Updated
Summary
Former President Trump’s criminal exposure growing as more witnesses coming forward to January 6th Committee, and the Georgia grand jury just sent subpoenas to Rudy Giuliani, John Eastman, and Senator Lindsey Graham on potential election interference. Georgia state senator on being a witness in the escalating criminal probe which hit Trump’s inner circle with subpoenas. Highland Park, Illinois officials are holding a news conference about the suspect in the July 4th parade mass shooting. Marq Claxton a retired NYPD detective joins Jason Johnson to give his reaction to the press conference about the suspect in the Highland Park and Akron Police that killed a Black man.
Transcript
NICOLLE WALLACE, MSNBC HOST: Thank you so much for letting us into your homes during these extraordinary times. We are grateful. THE BEAT with Jason Johnson in for Ari Melber will be up after a quick break. Don’t go anywhere.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JASON JOHNSON, MSNBC HOST: Welcome to THE BEAT. I’m Jason Johnson in for Ari Melber.
We start with more legal heat on Donald Trump. Shocker. The January 6th Committee saying more witnesses have come forward since the bombshell testimony exposing Trump for fueling the violent coup. More on this in a moment.
[18:05:06]
Well, Donald Trump will now have his allegiance tested for some of his closest allies. Breaking today, Rudy Giuliani and Senator Lindsey Graham have been subpoenaed by the Georgia criminal investigation, the grand jury probing Trump’s election interference. Also subpoenaed, coup mastermind, John Eastman, the Trump campaign lawyer, Jenna Ellis. The jury believes Giuliani, quote, “possesses unique knowledge concerning communications between himself, former President Trump, and the Trump campaign.”
The January 6th Committee also hammering Trump’s pressure on Georgia secretary of State to find 11,780 votes. A criminal probe witness who testified to the grand jury will join us here on THE BEAT exclusively. The January 6th Committee eyeing the role extremist groups played in the insurrection. The next public hearing will focus on ties between these groups and Trump world.
Roger Stone was spotted with Proud Boys on January 6th outside the Willard Hotel, the so-called legion of doom insurrection headquarters. And the star witness revealed Mark Meadows wanted to go as well.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. LIZ CHENEY (R-WY): Is it your understanding that Mr. Giuliani, Mr. Eastman and others had set up what has been called, quote, “a war room” at the Willard Hotel on the night of the 5th?
CASSIDY HUTCHINSON, FORMER AIDE TO CHIEF OF STAFF MARK MEADOWS: I was aware of that the night of the 5th.
CHENEY: And do you know if Mr. Meadows ever intended to go to the Willard Hotel on the night of the 5th?
HUTCHINSON: Mr. Meadows had a conversation with me where he wanted me to work with Secret Service on a movement from the White House from the Willard Hotel so he could attend the meeting or meetings with Mr. Giuliani and his associates in the war room.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNSON: Now more witnesses are coming forward to the panel and teasing more explosive evidence is to come.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. ADAM KINZINGER (R-IL): This happens every day. Every day we get new people that come forward and say, hey, I didn’t think maybe this piece of a story that I knew was important, but now that you guys — like I do see this plays in here.
DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR: Will we hear from witnesses that you did not know about, the stories you did not hear because of the hearings so far?
KINZINGER: Yes. Yes. There will be, there is, there will be way more information. And stay tuned.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNSON: I know sometimes you hear Trump is rattled but seriously he’s rattled. This is how we know. Trump is eyeing an early presidential run announcement, quote, “design in part to shield the former president from a stream of damaging revelations.” That would mean he can’t use $100 million in PAC money for whatever he wants. A clear sign here is he’s worried about prosecution. Conservative lawyers say he’ll be indicted. And now if he announces a run early, he can say the prosecution is political.
Merrick Garland, the ball will be in your court. Hope you can shoot.
Joining me now is Howard Dean, former DNC chair and governor of Vermont, and Danya Perry, former assistant U.S. attorney for the Southern District of New York and former deputy attorney general for the state of New York.
Danya, I’ll start with you. I am fascinated by what we’re seeing happening down in Georgia right now. I want to jump to the end of this because again I’m not a lawyer. I played one on TV. But it seems to me that if the president and his friends and his buddies, and members of his campaign, are going down to a state asking for votes, asking for additional information, putting pressure on people, that does seem to be some sort of election interference.
What would be the legal consequences if the president — the former president was found guilty of federal election interference in the state of Georgia?
DANYA PERRY, FORMER ASSISTANT U.S. ATTORNEY, SDNY: So it would be the D.A. in Fulton County Fani Willis is investigating state law violations of election interference and interference with official proceedings. So that is distinct from potential federal charges. And clearly antennas have gone up of law enforcement, state, local, and federal levels. The — her investigation, again, is different, separate and apart from any investigation that the Department of Justice may or may not be conducting when we hear rumors and rumbles.
But the D.A. there doesn’t have the same kind of political and prudential considerations that AG Merrick Garland certainly does. And so she’s a little more free from any of this politicization that we do see the Department of Justice concerning itself with. You know, there of course Garland has famously expressed and we also, you know, just see from observing that he is trying to depoliticize this. Trying not to look at this through a political lens.
[18:10:04]
Of course, you know, you can bend over backwards so far that you do a complete flip and it becomes political to not investigate or not prosecute. But Fani Willis does not have those same concerns and so she seems to be looking at this very seriously. Certainly seems to be keyed in to the witness testimony coming out of the January 6th Committee and is very focused on some of these witnesses who are going to push back and they’re going to scream and yell about attorney general privilege.
At the end of the day, I think it’s likely that judges will find in the same way that a federal district court judge did already in California with respect to John Eastman that the attorney-client privilege does not apply where there’s evidence of a fraud. So the crime, fraud, or other crimes. So the crime fraud exception very well may come into play here and allow the testimony of these witnesses.
JOHNSON: Governor Dean, I want to talk about what we’re or how we’re sort of getting these witnesses, and how the public is putting this together. So there are two more January 6th hearings. I don’t know why there’s only two. I think we should have January 6th hearings all the way up until November. I’m not doing the programming but we’ve got at least two right now. What do you think the public needs to see in these next two hearings?
We know the next one is going to be talking about connections to the Proud Boys. What are some things that you definitely think the public needs to hear in these next two hearings to absolutely solidify the case, to not just to make it clear that the previous president was fomenting a coup but basically to delegitimize anyone who is remotely connected with him and still wants to defend this big lie?
HOWARD DEAN, FORMER DNC CHAIR: Well, we’re not talking about huge majorities of people who haven’t already decided what they think of Donald Trump. The issue and why Georgia is so important from a political point of view it’s a critical swing state and there’s a Senate seat up that could be a potentially quite competitive that the Democrats need to win. I think we are going to win it.
But I think the big damage has already been done to Trump. I think the most horrifying thing for the American public is the January 6th footage of people assaulting the Capitol and killing — and four people dying as a result of that, including a police officer. So I think the damage has already been done. Trump will blather on about his guilt and the committee and all that stuff.
It’s pretty impressive when you see Liz Cheney up there, who’s, you know, pretty smart, and she is just laying waste to Trump and his people. So there’s 35 percent or 30 percent of people who are going to support Trump even if he is a dictator and an authoritarian. They kind of want an authoritarian government. But I think an enormous amount of damage has been done already in the court of public opinion.
I think that’s unlikely to change. And I do think some of this people eventually will be convicted. You cannot call the secretary of state and say, find me 11,700 votes, and expect that not to be the subject of a grand jury inquiry and most likely a trail.
JOHNSON: Danya, speaking of Liz Cheney, I want to play some sound from the congresswoman talking about what they think some of the results are going to be of this January 6th Committee was all concluded, and get your thoughts on the other side.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHENEY: We’ll make a decision as a committee about it.
JONATHAN KARL, ABC NEWS: So it’s possible there will be a criminal referral.
CHENEY: Yes.
KARL: Which would be effectively the committee saying that he should be prosecuted and this is the evidence that we’ve —
CHENEY: The Justice Department doesn’t have to wait for the committee to make a criminal referral. And there could be more than one criminal referral.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNSON: So right there, you’ve got Liz Cheney saying we may make a criminal referral. How much pressure does that put the Department of Justice under? You mentioned before. Look, you know, you can be so nonpolitical that you end up being political. But if we’ve got newspaper reports and the January 6th Committee, and everybody coming out of the woodwork saying, well, by the way, Donald Trump — at this point Donald Trump and Rudy Giuliani apparently went to everybody’s house begging for votes in the state of Georgia. I mean, they must have just gone door to door in Dekalb.
Do you think that direct criminal referrals announced at the end of the January 6th Committee will lead to sped up action on the part of the DOJ or are they going to continue on this sort of slow plotting path that we’re supposed to trust that they’re eventually going to come to a conclusion with before Congress possibly flips?
PERRY: It’s a great question. The Department of Justice typically prides itself on inhabiting a kind of apolitical bubble. In my 11 years at the Department of Justice, we really didn’t concern ourselves with what, you know, what will flow from this. We kind of followed the law, followed the facts, and did what was the right thing. Here, obviously this is a situation unlike any other. It’s what you say in the law sui generis. It’s really it’s its own thing.
[18:15:01]
I would like to think that a referral would apply more pressure on the Department of Justice. As Vice Chairwoman Cheney said, the Department of Justice does not need a referral. It can of course observe justice many Americans are observing. They can see in real time what the evidence is and where that points. But I do think a referral, in this case, it’s the odd situation where it may actually have the opposite and unintended effect where it creates more political pressure, which is exactly what AG Garland seems not to want.
So in a strange way, this might be the rare case where they should come to their own conclusions, listen to the evidence like everyone else is, and draw conclusions that seem on their face, you know, to be impossible not to come away with.
JOHNSON: Right. So, Governor Dean, I just want to end with this very quickly. You now have some Republican, some, very quiet, right, grownups in the room, who are saying, hey, look, maybe Donald Trump shouldn’t run again. Maybe it’s going to be a problem. Maybe, you know, him running with all these sort of allegations and all this violence associated with him, maybe it ends up being damaging for the party.
I’m not falling for a banana in the tail pipe again. There have been people complaining about Trump for five years and he keeps running. Do you think any of these charges or potential allegations could influence when he’s going to decide to make an announcement? Or do you think it’s just a done deal that the former president will run again in 2024?
DEAN: I don’t think it’s a done deal at all. And I have no idea what his calculation is. But, you know, we won in Georgia, particularly, in the Senate because of Donald Trump. Because there were a number of Republican women, moderate Republican women in the suburbs who couldn’t stomach voting for this crook, and this disgusting person. And they just couldn’t. And that’s happening all over the country every day, the more stuff that comes out.
So I’m actually hoping that Trump does run. I think Trump’s calculation is mixed up with his illness which is narcissism, acute narcissism, and it’s also mixed with the political calculation that he’s not very good at. I mean, you know, there are a lot of younger people in that party that are much scarier. DeSantis, for one, who just requires, just today announced he was going to require all students in Florida’s colleges to declare their political views. I mean, this guy is a fascist.
JOHNSON: Right.
DEAN: Trump is too narcissistic and ill to be a successful fascist. Even though he has all those instincts, and I think he’ll be easier to beat than any of the other potential candidates.
JOHNSON: Howard Dean and Danya Perry, thank you so much for starting us off on THE BEAT today.
Coming up, more on these new subpoenas in the Trump criminal probe. We have an exclusive live interview with a witness who just talked to the grand jury. You don’t want to miss it. Plus, a special guest on how far-right wing radio is laying the groundwork for the next election coup. And the latest on the Highland Park massacre. And a police shooting that left 60 bullets in a young black man’s body and a lot of unanswered question.
Stay with us. Jason Johnson on THE BEAT.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JOHNSON: Digging deeper in the breaking news, and it’s got to have Trump nervous. Brand new subpoenas today from the Georgia grand jury investigating Trump and his allies, potentially criminal efforts, potentially, to subvert the 2020 election. Rudy Giuliani, coup mastermind John Eastman, Trump lawyer Jenna Ellis, Republican Senator Lindsey Graham, and others, literally, a murderous row. Giuliani pushed the coup hard in Georgia, testifying before state legislators three different times, making bogus allegations of fraud in each one.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUDY GIULIANI, FORMER PERSONAL ATTORNEY FOR PRESIDENT TRUMP: The connection to Hugo Chavez, it’s a highly inaccurate machine but it does cast doubt on the entire legitimacy of the vote. What would that suggest? Phantom votes. That pattern has appeared in other states that were involved in massive fraud.
There is overwhelming proof of fraud. Don’t have to be a genius to figure out what happened. Right? I don’t have to be a genius to figure out that those votes are not legitimate votes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNSON: Those people look very unconvinced. The subpoena stating Giuliani, quote, “possesses unique knowledge concerning communications between himself, former President Trump, the Trump campaign and others involved in the multistate coordinated scheme.”
And then there’s John Eastman, the Trump attorney behind the baseless theory that Mike Pence could block the results on January 6th. Today’s subpoena citing Eastman’s advice to Georgia lawmakers that they have the, quote, “duty to throw out electors” and here’s why.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN EASTMAN, FORMER LAWYER FOR PRESIDENT TRUMP: In the early decades of our nation’s history, most state legislatures selected their state’s presidential electors themselves. I don’t think it’s just your authority to do that but quite frankly I think you have a duty to do that, to protect the integrity of the election here in Georgia.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNSON: In the early parts of the U.S. Constitution, I couldn’t vote either. Lindsey Graham is in hot water for allegedly phoning Georgia’s secretary of State and asking if he could toss out certain mail ballots. An incident that Trump echoed weeks later with his own famous call with the Georgia official telling him to, quote, “find votes.”
Today marks the first time that Georgia grand jury subpoenas have hit high level Trump insiders. But District Attorney Fani Willis has gotten more than 50 witnesses to willingly come forward. That includes my next guest. You can see her in this photo. She is the lawmaker seated to the left of the screen, talking to Giuliani during a break in one of those notorious hearings.
Democratic State Senator Jen Jordan has testified behind closed doors to the grand jury. She is my exclusive guest live on THE BEAT when we’re back in just 60 seconds.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JOHNSON: Joining me now is Georgia State Senator Jennifer Jordan who testified before the Fulton County grand jury investigating Trump and his allies’ efforts to overturn the 2020 election results. She is also running to become Georgia’s attorney general.
Senator, thank you so much for joining us on THE BEAT tonight.
STATE SEN. JEN JORDAN (D-GA): Thank you for having me.
JOHNSON: Thank you. I have to start with this because I think this is the question that lots of regular people are thinking. What was it like having Rudy Giuliani, who you know is like the right hand man of the former president, show up and say, hey, I’ve got this presentation for you? Like when you first heard that he wanted to speak to several state legislators, did you think, OK, do they have some legitimate question? Were you concerned? Like what was your first thought when you found out you were going to have a meeting with Giuliani, potentially to discuss the election?
JORDAN: Look, we had no idea the Democratic state senator, and I’ll tell you that I really didn’t know what was going on or who was going to be present until I walked into that Senate committee room.
[18:25:02]
And I’ll tell you, it was surreal. You know, you walk in and there’s Rudy Giuliani. There’s, you know, all the people you see, or have seen on television, and even the OAN White House correspondent was there, and Newsmax. I mean, all of these people. And it really felt like what in the world is happening? But we had no clue that it was going to happen. It really did feel like a set-up.
JOHNSON: So you show up. It’s like a friend who says we’re going to have lunch and it ends up being a crazy network marketing meeting, right? And you’re like, OK, now we’ve got to sit through this whole thing. Once he — once Giuliani went through his entire presentation, did it seem like he was just making it up all along? I mean, was the idea to convince you that some fraud had occurred? Or do you think it was more the idea to intimidate you by suggesting, hey, look, we’re going to push this, either go along with our crazy scheme or get balled over?
JORDAN: Look, I think what it was really about was providing what they believe to be some kind of legitimate basis for the legislature to go into special session and basically throw out, you know, the slate of electors that have been chosen by the voters of Georgia. You know, me and another state senator were sitting there, we had no clue who was going to show up.
JOHNSON: Right.
JORDAN: Who was going to give testimony. I’m literally Googling who is John Eastman when he pops up, and I’m like, how are we going to cross examine this guy? And he purported to be giving expert testimony, you know, on the Georgia constitution and Georgia law. And the man isn’t even a Georgia lawyer. So it was one of those things where I think what we see from the January 6th Committee, we see kind of the overarching scheme. I think what we saw on the ground in Georgia in December was the actual implementation of it.
JOHNSON: I want to play you — Senator Jordan, I want to play you some sound because you talked about what’s happening on the ground. Georgia has sort of opened America’s eyes to what the bullying and terrorism is like on the ground. I want to play this from the January 6th Committee hearings and get your thoughts on the other side.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUBY FREEMAN, FORMER FULTON COUNTY ELECTION WORKER: There is nowhere I feel safe. Nowhere. Do you know how it feels to have the president of the United States target you?
SHAYE MOSS, FORMER FULTON COUNTY ELECTION WORKER: I just don’t do nothing no more. I don’t want to go anywhere. I second-guess everything that I do. This has affected my life in a major way, in every way. All because of lies.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNSON: Senator, you’re running for attorney general in the state of Georgia. You’re down there on the ground. Have you also experienced this kind of violence and intimidation? I mean, look, you’re just testifying locally. But it doesn’t take much for the right-wing blogosphere to find names and put addresses out there. Have you felt threatened since coming forward to fight against this attempted coup on the part of the former president?
JORDAN: Yes. Almost immediately. Even during the Senate committee meeting. Almost as it is being live-streamed, right? So Trump is telling all of his Twitter followers to tune into the live stream. And so as they’re watching when I’m asking questions and pushing back, or when another state senator is asking questions and pushing back, we immediately start getting threats. You know, it was one of those situations where I think that was intended to intimidate us more to try to keep us, you know, from actually opposing this whole sham idea that they were putting out there.
And look, it is scary. And part of the reason that those poor women have suffered the way they have is because of that hearing, because of that video that really was edited in a very creative way to make it seem like election workers in Fulton County were doing something wrong. At the end of the day, all they were doing was their jobs.
JOHNSON: You have an election this fall. You’re part of a slate. You’ve got Bee Nguyen who’s running for secretary of state. You’ve Stacey Abrams, you’ve got Raphael Warnock. The strong of slate of Democrats running in Georgia this year. If you become attorney general and let’s say, there is a Republican secretary of state, how do you think these kinds of conflicts could end up playing out in 2024? Do you think you could end up at logger heads if there’s an election denier Republican who ends up being a secretary of state in 2024?
JORDAN: Absolutely. Look, I mean, the way I look at the attorney general’s office is that I’m supposed to be the attorney for the people of the state of Georgia. And if there is anyone that is trying to overturn a lawful election and not count the lawful votes of the people in this state, then absolutely.
You know, I view the role of the AG as kind of standing in the gap when nobody else will. And part of hopefully, you know, will elect Democrats up and down the ballot. But I will say that even if it’s just me, I think that the A.G. has an incredibly important role to make sure that people follow the law and that our democracy actually can withstand some of the attacks that you know, we’ve been going through.
[18:30:00]
JOHNSON: Georgia voters just put the whole slate in, and then everybody can actually work together to count your votes in 2024. State Senator Jen Jordan, thank you so very much, and good luck in your race.
JORDAN: Thank you, Jason. Really appreciate it.
JOHNSON: Ahead, a special guest on the right-wing media machines, big lie obsession. And the Highland Park massacre. What we know about how the suspect got the rifle. Plus, protests and hard questions after police shoot and kill a black man, striking Jayland Walker with over 60 rounds. We come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JOHNSON: Officials or holding a news conference —
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ERIC RINEHART, ATTORNEY, LAKE COUNTY: Including the FBI, ATF, and U.S. Attorney’s Office have also been critical partners in this investigation, and you will hear a bit more from them this evening. These officers not only ran towards the danger but worked tirelessly throughout the day and night to investigate and solve this case. I want to also thank all of the community members and business members and leaders who provided us with dozens of videos and photos.
We continue our requests for those photos and videos. This is still an open and active investigation. Please continue to contact all of the tip lines that we have suggested. To those who are physically and psychologically suffering today, in hospitals and in homes throughout our community. We offer our most fervent and urgent prayers. We are offered prayers for healing, even though it feels that it may be so far away.
I know that Mayor Rotering and Highland Park Police Chief Lou Jogmen, Lake County, and our federal partners have already started the critical work of supporting the individuals who need us so much while they are in the throes of trauma. Today our office deployed victim-witness counselors and licensed therapists also to Highland Park. Dozens of private individuals have volunteered to help.
This has been one of the most uplifting things I’ve ever seen in Lake County’s history. The community has come together even in the throes of trauma. The loss of life and these devastating injuries and the overwhelming psychological trauma. Demand we seek justice and that we take broader action to protect life.
Today the Lake County State’s Attorney’s Office has charged Robert Crimo III with seven counts of first-degree murder. For the killing spree that he has unleashed against our community. These are just the first of many charges that will be filed against Mr. Crimo. I want to emphasize that. There will be more charges.
[18:35:00]
We anticipate dozens of more charges centering around each of the victims, psychological victims, physical victims, attempt murder charges, aggravated discharge charges, aggravated battery charges, there will be dozens of more charges against Mr. Crimo. But these seven counts of first-degree murder will lead to a mandatory life sentence should he be convicted without the possibility of parole.
None of these charges would be possible again, without the unbelievable efforts of law enforcement, I cannot thank them enough. I have to thank the men and women of the Lake County State’s Attorney’s Office who had been working with law enforcement since the moment that we identified a suspect. We continue to work with our federal partners to understand every aspect of this well-orchestrated and carefully planned crime.
Tomorrow morning at the Lake County Courthouse, we will ask a judge to hold Mr. Crimo without the possibility of bail. As I mentioned — as I mentioned our support for victims started today. Both from the state’s attorney’s office, from the mayor’s office, from the city of Highland Park, from the police department, from the FBI Victim Assistance group.
We will guide them through the court process and deal with a trauma that will ripple forever outside of the courtrooms. But how do we make sure that there are no more victims? What should have been a celebration of freedom has ended in despair for our community. All of the people who died steps from here lost their freedom, all of it.
Every ounce of freedom that they had, the freedom to love, the freedom to learn, and the freedom to live a full life. Their freedom matters too. We must do more as we think and reflect upon their freedom on this July 5th. Illinois has a strong Red Flag Law that keeps community safe and respects everyone’s rights. We must vastly increase awareness and education about this Red Flag Law called the Illinois firearm restraining order.
The goal — the goal of this tool is to ensure the safety of the individual and those around them. It allows courts to temporarily remove guns and prevent the purchase of new guns by individuals who pose a significant rest. As I said, this tool allows temporary removal from the subject and prohibits the new purchase during the duration of the order.
It allows individuals to stabilize their treatments — excuse me, stabilize their behavior, seek treatment, and access other resources that our community must invest in to give those who need help. But separate from these Red Flag Laws, which are very powerful in Illinois. We should also ban assault weapons in Illinois and beyond.
The assault weapon ban — the assault weapon ban was implemented in 1994 with bipartisan support, and with the support of law enforcement. It lasted for 10 years. And studies have shown that mass shootings like what happened yesterday went down during those 10 years. We should have that same ban in Illinois and beyond. In the entire country.
The Lake County State’s Attorney’s Office stands with the people of Highland Park. As I said earlier, this is where I am raising my family also. Our violent crimes unit will continue to work with all of our law enforcement partners to continue to build this case. As I said it is an active and ongoing investigation. Our victim services unit will answer every question, every text, every phone call, and every concern.
We will stand with the survivors of this awful crime for as long as is necessary. In the courtroom, we will seek the maximum sentence against this offender. Not because we seek vengeance, but because justice and the healing process demand it. As we go forward in the courtroom and in the community, we must do everything we can to make sure the horror that marks these streets, that echoed from these buildings never happens again.
[18:40:00]
Thank you very much. At this time, I would introduce U.S. attorney and really our partner in this investigation so far. U.S. Attorney John Lausch.
JOHN R. LAUSCH, U.S. ATTORNEY, NORTHERN DISTRICT OF ILLINOIS: Thank you. My name is John Lausch. I’m the United States Attorney here in the Northern District of Illinois. I want to echo some of the same words we just heard from State’s Attorney Rinehart, and commend all the law enforcement partners and agencies who are represented here today. In all of our first responders for everything they did, to bravely put their lives on the line to help others in need.
Our office, the U.S. Attorney’s Office, and our other Department of Justice components. Most notably, the FBI and the ATF, have been working very closely with our state and local law enforcement partners to investigate this horrific attack. We have been and we will remain in regular communication with these partners. And in particular, the Lake County State’s Attorney’s Office and I have been in regular contact with State’s Attorney Rinehart, since the beginning of this investigation.
These state murder charges are appropriate at this time, we will continue to deploy our federal resources in collaboration with the state local partners to ensure that individuals who correct — commit horrific acts of violence like these using firearms are held accountable. And with that, I’d like to turn it over to the chief of the Highland Park Police Department Lou Jogmen.
LOU JOGMEN, HIGHLAND PARK POLICE DEPARTMENT CHIEF: The last approximately 36 hours had been a lesson in the duality of humanity. While the actions that brought us all together expose the cruelty and callousness that one person could show to people he did not know and taking their lives.
The unwavering commitment of our Highland Park team, the drive, and determination of those who assisted us in making this arrest, and the outpouring of love and support from the community and from people across the nation and the globe, have shown us the best in humanity.
The American spirit weaved throughout this response to this horrific and absolutely senseless act of violence. We will not be standing here this afternoon announcing the arrest of this suspect without the assistance of countless law enforcement agencies from multiple counties, from the Illinois State Police, FBI, ATF, (INAUDIBLE) Lake County Coroner’s Office, the hospital staff, our medical community. And Deputy Chief Chris Cavalli of the Lake County Major Crimes Task Force. Thank you.
To the Highland Park community, your strength has buoyed our team through the darkest moments. To our city of Highland Park team, the fire department, public works, our city manager’s office, our finance, and our community development departments. Your contributions have been invaluable and we thank you.
To Mayor Rotering in the city council thank you for your sustained engagement and unwavering support and to the men and women with whom I serve alongside in the Highland Park Police Department, it is an honor and a privilege to serve with you.
Your commitment and determination to see justice served for this community inspires me. I am proud of Illinois law enforcement. At this time, I would like to introduce Lake County Sheriff Deputy Chief Chris Covelli, who has been a spokesperson for the major crime assistance team.
CHRISTOPHER COVELLI, LAKE COUNTY MAJOR CRIME TASK FORCE SPOKESMAN: Thank you, chief. I’m just going to read a brief statement on behalf of the victim service response team of the FBI. Beginning tomorrow the FBI’s victim service response team will be working in conjunction with local state and federal aid groups to staff a Family Assistance Center.
At the Family Assistance Center, victims will be offered trauma counseling, government aid assistance, and if necessary financial assistance. Victims are not just those physically injured and yesterday’s events, but also those experiencing emotional distress. The center will open tomorrow July 6th at noon.
Victims of yesterday’s incident are invited to access available services at the Highland Park High School and that’s located at 433 Vine Avenue in Highland Park. The Family Assistance Center will be available from noon tomorrow until 9:00 p.m., Thursday and Friday from 9:00 a.m. until 9:00 p.m., and thereafter as needed. Additional information regarding the return of personal effects left at the scene will also be released tomorrow.
With that, we are going to open it up for some questions. I would just ask for a little bit of patience. We have a lot of stakeholders that are joining us today. So, we can filter who is best to answer each of the questions asked. Phil (PH)?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chris, can we ask a question to state’s attorney (INAUDIBLE)? RINEHART
COVELLI: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. States Attorney, you went out of your way to note the red flag laws. You now know that this individual had contacts with law enforcement in 2018, were reportedly contacts the city (INAUDIBLE) family. A number of lives were taken away from it at that time. Should that have been a qualifying event under the Red Flag Law (INAUDIBLE), buying firearms in 2020 (INAUDIBLE)?
[18:45:00]
RINEHART: We have to look at every case on a case-by-case basis. I don’t know the internal process of the Illinois State Police in terms of after that report was taken. We know there was not an application for a FOID depending at that time. The current Red Flag Laws, you have a process where things are reported to the Illinois State Police with respect to voids.
And then you have the Red Flag Laws, which is what I was referring to, which were passed in 2019, or effective in 2019. In terms of getting a court order, where family members and other individuals who know the — know the — the person at issue have to go to a court. So, my reference to the Red Flag Laws refers to that regime with respect to the Illinois State Police that has to do with the FOID application process.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If I hear you right, what you’re saying is possibly this qualifying (INAUDIBLE) for the fourth fact. (INAUDIBLE) actually applied for FOID, attained the FOID —
RINEHART: I would definitely refer all of those questions the Illinois State Police in terms of that internal process back in 2019.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The timeline, does this mean that he had a legal guardian sponsor on his FOID card? Did he get his FOID card before he was 21 (INAUDIBLE) legal guardian sponsored, and if so, are you looking at charges at all?
RINEHART: I’m absolute — I am absolutely not going to get into that level of detail on the investigation in our process.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE).
RINEHART: I’m not going to (INAUDIBLE).
COVELLI: Investigators are very thoroughly looking at every aspect of this. There are a number of theories on the table as to why he left his weapon there. I don’t want to get into and speculate anything at this point, you know, there is still a lot of investigative work to go. But that is something investigators are looking into.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Essentially (INAUDIBLE).
COVELLI: That’s very possible, it’s very clear to investigators. He attempted to blend in with the rest of the victims who are fleeing the scene, carrying a rifle, I would imagine wouldn’t allow one to blend in very well.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE).
COVELLI: The weapon led to him directly.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Like blend in your driver’s license.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).
COVELLI: Investigators are still looking into that. They’re still working many different angles. We do know he went on a drive following the events. But as to why that’s not something I can get into right now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).
LAUSCH: I think the best answer for that is to echo the same points that were made. This is an ongoing investigation. And it really wouldn’t be appropriate for me to comment any further at this time. But that the charges right now, these are very appropriate charges right now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).
LAUSCH: It should not read anything into one way or the other, it would not be appropriate for the comment one way or the other, whether or not there will be federal charges. OK.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).
LAUSCH: OK, so — there’s a lot — there’s a lot packed into that question. Here’s what I will say, is the partners that are here, OK? And in particular, FBI and ATF are the ones that are standing with me. They work every single day in order to mitigate threats that they learn off.
And this is a particular instance, when we had the horrific attack that happened yesterday, how they came to right away in order to help law enforcement ultimately be able to make this case and to bring the appropriate charges in state court. But again, at this point, I think it’s fair to say from our end, this is an ongoing investigation.
I’m very proud to be up here with my colleague from the Lake County State’s Attorney’s Office, but it really wouldn’t be appropriate for me to comment any further about whether — whether or not any federal charges are likely. Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chris, give us any further clarification on the weapons where (INAUDIBLE).
COVELLI: So, what I know firsthand at this time is that two of the weapons were obtained within the region here. Those were two of the rifles. The rifle used in the attack was purchased by him. And I just want to follow up on the question that you asked a little earlier. It’s important to note Highland Park Police when they responded to that 2019 incident.
They removed the weapons that Crimo possess. There were no firearms at that time to be removed. So as the state’s attorney said the Red Flag Laws, there were no Red Flag Laws to go after firearms in that home at that time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, you said the rifles were obtained in the region, but there were two rifles and four handguns?
[18:50:00]
COVELLI: I can’t say four handguns. There were a total of five guns — five firearms that he possessed.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. What about the weapon you said, the two rifles in the region (INAUDIBLE).
COVELLI: They were bought in Illinois. I’d have to get specifics as to exactly where.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He got the FOID card before he was 21, is that true?
COVELLI: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, that means he was sponsored by a legal guardian (INAUDIBLE).
COVELLI: I don’t want to speak to the process of the Illinois State Police. I don’t have enough of their internal information to accurately respond. Yes, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What happened when the — when he went in the house (INAUDIBLE) investigation (INAUDIBLE).
COVELLI: Again, Highland Park Police notify the Illinois State Police where it goes from there. I don’t want to speak to it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can I you a question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE).
COVELLI: At this point, we don’t have reason to believe that they may have known things but the investigation is still very active. Investigators have a lot of legwork to do. So —
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE).
COVELLI: What I’ll say is investigators have spoken. To the family, I don’t want to gauge their level of cooperation one way or another.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) magazine. So, how many rounds (INAUDIBLE)?
COVELLI: The magazines held approximately 30 rounds of rifle ammunition. Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you so much, everybody. (INAUDIBLE) just hold here for a minute off some more information for you shortly.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How many magazines were there?
COVELLI: Multiple, over 70 rounds.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNSON: Officials announcing seven counts of first-degree murder for the Highland Park shooting suspect with more to come. Joining me now is Marq Claxton, retired NYPD detective now director of the Black Law Enforcement Alliance. Mark, what’s your reaction to that presser? I’m hit with a lot of emotions and a lot of questions. But as a retired officer, what’s your response to what we just heard at that press conference?
MARQ CLAXTON, RETIRED NYPD DETECTIVE: Well, I mean, there was significant and substantial disclosures by law enforcement. But to be honest with you, Jason, this feels more like a Groundhog Day moment. We’ve been in his position many times. We’ve heard many of the same statements by different law enforcement representatives. And it is painfully too familiar for larger community.
I think what’s missing in a lot of the discussions or a lot of the energy and movement towards how do we affect positive change. And as far as minimizing the level of gun violence in a nation is, you know, examining the pathology of these domestic violent extremists. These mass shootings have a somewhat similar kind of tone and ring to them.
And we have to begin to examine and connect the dots, and use some of that predictive policing that law enforcement community is oftentimes talking glowingly about when trying to assess the level of risk there is out there from these domestic violent extremists.
JOHNSON: I’ve connected the dots right here. It’s alienated young white men who are influenced by right-wing philosophy. We have videos of this guy talking about violence. He’s a failed rapper, he’s a Trump supporter. I mean, what — the profile of these mass shooters is playing to see for anybody. It’s plain to see. We see the race, we see the ideology, we see the access to weapons.
We can’t do anything in America about races. We can’t do anything in America about racist white guys, we can’t do anything in America, about people feeling alienated. And most people who have mental illness don’t engage in violence. But we can do something about guns. And so, my question to you is, when you hear — some of these local officials say, hey, look, an assault weapons ban would make this a lot easier.
Do you think anyone, do you think more state police, do you think national police unions across the country will take up that banner and put pressure on the Republican Party, because we know they’re the ones behind this, put pressure on the Republican Party to push for with an assault weapons ban? Because the other factors that led to this violence, we can’t stop those things.
CLAXTON: It’s already been established that a lot of the national organizations that are supposed to be supportive of law enforcement or even made up of law enforcement don’t have the courage or the integrity to demand an assault weapons ban. And a lot of the legislation even enacted legislation and proposed legislation is just hitting around the edges and playing games with what is an obvious issue of problem.
There’s a clear path to mitigate damage and minimize the level of danger caused by these domestic violent extremists and the firearms, the guns that they use to inflict so much pain across the community. It’s a question of whether or not individuals, entities are committed to really effecting change. Are they satisfied with just having a press conference post- incident and explaining what happened and what prosecution will take place.
[18:55:00]
JOHNSON: And one thing here I — Marq, I thought this was interesting. In this presser you have one of the attorneys say, hey, look, we’re doing this for justice, this is not for revenge. I have no problem with this is for revenge. There are families that have lost kids, there are families that have lost loved ones, there are people who will be forever traumatized by this. You don’t have to lose someone.
There’s a nine-year-old kid out there that saw somebody get their brains blown out, and they’re never going to be OK. Again, do you think that the urgency of these moments is ever going to break through, because the idea that there is no place safe in this country, do you really think we’re at a point in this nation where people are just like, I guess I’m just going to throw up my hands and I’ll never go to a grocery store and I’ll never go to a fourth of July fireworks event?
You know, are we living at a point where law enforcement and right-wing forces have just said that getting shot randomly has to be a way of life?
CLAXTON: I think what’s happening is that they have kind of discounted or ignored the PTSD that we, not even those people who are directly involved and affected by this level of violence are experiencing. There is a collective PTSD across this nation. That’s why these types of shootings, these types of mass killings have more impact on people as of late.
And people are having trouble addressing and dealing with it from an emotional, from a physical, and emotional standpoint. And I think that you have entities, you have politicians, and socio-political organizations that are not accounting for the PTSD that the everyday person is experiencing throughout the nation whether or not you got shot a shot at or you lost a family member. We’re all suffering from this PTSD brought on by this level of gun violence.
JOHNSON: And while we’re all suffering from the PTSD of gun violence, we are not equally suffering under the violence of police themselves. I want to turn to a disturbing police incident out of Akron, Ohio. Police are releasing body camera footage of the fatal shooting of 25-year-old Jayland Walker.
Shot dead by police after fleeing a traffic stop last Monday, you know, fleeing just like the shooter did in Parkland, but he survived. Police are now saying Walker suffered more than 60 gunshot wounds and was unarmed at the time of the shooting. This gun was recovered in the vehicle but police confirming it was unarmed at the time of the shooting.
Killing sparking protests in downtown Akron, hundreds demanding justice for Walker. Civil rights activists calling the killer quote — calling the killing, quote, a murder. I’m going to take you through the incident and show you this body cam footage. I want to warn you the footage is disturbing. Seconds into the pursuit, the police department described the sound that was quote, consistent with a gunshot.
(Begin VT)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Shots fired. That vehicle had a shot come out of its door.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNSON: That vehicle referring to Walker’s then as officers surrounded Walker he jumped out of the car and ran. You know, away from them, making them in less danger. Police chased him. The department said they first deployed stun guns before unloading a hail of bullets killing him.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He’s slowing down here, slowing down. (BLEEP) (INAUDIBLE). (BLEEP) (INAUDIBLE). Don’t (BLEEP) move. Don’t (BLEEP) move. Show your hands. Show me your (BLEEP) hands.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNSON: Crimo was asked if he could do them a favor. They almost bought them a hamburger. This guy gets shot. Police said he suffered more than 60 gunshot wounds. The police chief saying the officers must be accountable for every single shot fired.
Handling the incident, police fatally shooting Walker as he fled that traffic stop is in stark contrast to how the police treated 22-year-old suspect in that Highland Park mass shooting incident this weekend that killed seven and injured dozens.
That suspect was arrested without incident. Marq, is there any way to reform this, because short of complete police abolition, I don’t think you can train people out of the kind of behavior that we saw from Akron this weekend.
CLAXTON: You can’t train — you can’t train people out of that type of behavior who are ingrained into a system that has become corrupt within itself and reluctant or in denial about recognizing the role that race has played historically in the enforcement of laws and what role that plays in the killing of black and brown people by police. At such a disproportionate number.
There’s no way to get around it until we are willing or to have a conversation about the role that race plays in these incidents, there is no resolution to them. And I will predict that we will be back in this place again shortly having another discussion about another black man shot in a similar way in short order, if god spares our life.
JOHNSON: Marq Claxton, thank you very much. “THE REIDOUT” with Joy Reid is up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)